“The Trial” — Section 29
What is the need for modern-day revelation? We have the Bible!
Representative of a Christian church:
Thus far you have shown that your latter-day scriptures can be harmonious, but you have not as yet proved a need for them. Can you, from the scriptures, prove a need for latter-day revelation?
Missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints:
We will be pleased to do so. We read in 2 Peter 3:15-16 that Peter made reference to Paul’s writings, and said, “…account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable, wrest as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.” That includes 14 epistles, or about 53% of the New Testament books. Christ said, “When anyone heareth the word of the kingdom and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart.” (Matthew 13:19) Here we have 53% of the New Testament and a mass of people who will not understand the things that are spoken pertaining to salvation by Paul. That sounds like a crying need for ongoing revelation to me.
Representative of a Christian church:
I feel that you are exaggerating your points. We read in Ephesians 3:4, “Whereby, when ye read ye many understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ.” Thus, all you have to do is read to understand.
Missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints:
I appreciate your answer, but there are two things that perhaps you haven’t considered. First, Ephesians 3:4 mentioned that the mystery would be revealed when you read and the mystery was answered in Romans 16:25 and Ephesians 1:9-11. That mystery was that through the blood of Christ we have our inheritance. It had been a mystery since the beginning of the world, with the Jewish nations sacrificing animals to the “God of Israel” because it was commanded of them, and yet they really didn’t know why. Paul, in Hebrews 10:10-12, pointed out that “every priest standeth daily ministering at the altar offering oftentimes the same sacrifice for sins, but this man (Christ), after he had offered one sacrifice for sin for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.” Therefore, the mystery (which means revealed truth) was that we would be adopted “by obedience” as the sons of God by the precious blood of Christ who died for our sins. All Paul pointed out in Ephesians 3:4 was to read Ephesians 1 and they would know the mystery, but Peter’s concern was not the mystery, but on salvation that many of the saints were confused about. That is our second issue. Peter was talking about salvation, not the mystery of the adoption. History bears record that Ephesians was written before 2nd Peter, and if all you had to do was read Paul’s writings (since you agreed that all their writings were harmonious), Peter would never have mentioned that they were hard to be understood because Ephesians 3:4 would have pointed out that all you had to do was read them. That is why they needed the “gift of the Holy Ghost”. It was to guide them into salvation. Therefore, as we have established from the scriptures, there is a need for revelation. I would also like to provide another need for revelation today. We have in Deuteronomy 18:21-22 a scripture that informs us that when a man speaks in the name of the Lord, it follows that that man is a prophet. I refer you to Matthew 12:40 and the statement of Christ where he prophesied his death and resurrection: “…for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale, so shall the son of Man be three days and three nights in the belly of the earth.” Matthew 27:62 and Matthew 28:1 prove that the crucifixion was on Friday and on this fateful Friday, mark informs us that he was placed upon the cross at the third hour (Mark 15:25) although John records it was the sixth hour. We will accept Mark’s account that it ws the third hour (9 am) and that Christ was upon the cross alive for six hours, until the ninth hour (3 pm). Matthew 27:46-51 and Luke 23:44-46 record that Christ gave up His spirit and died at that time. This, of course, would make Friday the first day. Then Joseph of Arimathea and Nicodemus gained permission to remove Christ’s body from the cross, and place it in a large tomb. We know that Christ’s body was placed in the tomb before sunset because Jewish law demanded that nothing remain on a cross over the Sabbath. Therefore, Christ’s entry in the tomb could be accurately estimated at the eleventh hour (5 pm), making the first day. Friday night would have been the first night and the Saturday, would be the second day, and Saturday night would be the second night, and we then find that the Lord was was resurrected sometime on the dawn of Sunday morning (John 20:1, Luke 24:1, mark 16:2, Matthew 28:1-2), making it the third day. This would mean he was in the ‘belly of the earth’ Friday, Saturday, and Sunday during the days, but only on Friday and Saturday nights. This would make Christ’s statement in Matthew 12:40 incorrect. Thus, we need revelation to answer this supposedly inaccurate prophecy of our Savior? Would you agree with us?
Representative of a Christian church:
What about the 3 hours of darkness (Luke 23:44), which would technically be ‘night’. This would make a ‘night’ on Friday from the sixth to the ninth hour, a regular night on Friday, and a night on Saturday. That makes three nights and three days.
Missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints:
Let’s examine the prophecy more closely. It said that Christ would be in the heart of the earth or tomb for three days and three nights, and this was to be the only sign to the Pharisees. Matthew records that at the ninth hour or very close to it, Christ asked for God’s spirit to be with him, and in great agony stated, “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” We read where shortly afterwards, he died, it being the ninth hour, when darkness had ceased. Mark records that it was at the 9th hour Christ made the declaration to God and asked why he had been forsaken, and thereby death was placed at the time darkness was to have left the earth. Then prophecy called for Christ being ‘in the heart of the earth’. Thus, three hours of darkness could not have possibly accounted for the first night because he was still upon the cross. Since it was Jewish law that no one hang on a cross over the Sabbath, and the nightfall which marked the beginning of the Sabbath was beginning to approach (which would have been the 12th hour or 6 pm), the apostle John records that guards went to Pilate and requested permission to break the legs of the three that hung on the crosses (the two thieves and Christ) of which permission was granted. However, when they arrived at the foot of the cross, as John records, they discovered that Christ was dead. This places Christ on the cross at some time considerably after the 9th hour. Then, to insure death , one of the guards placed a spear in his side. Therefore, from the time Christ was taken from the cross and place in the tomb, it can easily be estimated between the 9th and 12th hours, and probably closer to the 12th hour. The reason he was placed in the tomb was because it was so near the Sabbath. So it appears, gentlemen, that your reasoning is faulty. Christ was in the heart of the earth, according to the Bible, for but three days and two nights, and so we have proven a real need for additional revelation.
Representative of a Christian church:
Are you proposing that Mormon revelation contains the answer?
Missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints:
Yes, we are. As we began our trial, you introduced the scripture Luke 21:44, crossing referencing that with 3 Nephi 8:22-26 to establish a supposed contraindication between the Bible and the Book of Mormon. There is your answer right there. It is a volume of scripture that bears record that Jesus is the Christ, and still established his claim as Lord and Christ, and a prophet (Acts 3:22), which the Bible cannot do according to Matthew 12:40. That is one reason why there were three days of darkness on this continent. It was a sign to those people of the death of our Lord, and was to bear witness that Jesus was Christ. We have proven to you a need for ongoing revelation, we have proven it harmoniously, and now we have proven it progressively. It truly is the work of the Lord.
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